H&K G36 really that bad?

[Max]

Hello guys

I don't know if you noticed, but right now, the german press developed the "G36 affair".
The german Bundeswehr seems to have accuracy-problems with their new Heckler & Koch G36-rifles, which has, as part of a series of equipment-problems, called the defense-minister into action, and, after a long phase of people discussing stuff they had no knowledge about, led to the german Bundeswehr replacing their expensive and just-bought G36 rifles.

Now I wondered.
Is the G36 really just such a bad rifle, which would go against what I heard of other H&K-products, or could it have one of the following reasons:
-It is widely known that german soldiers get little time on the range, so maybe accuracy would improve if they'd get to spend more time training with their new rifles.
-A rather compact rifle like the G36 (especially the "G36K", with the even shorter barrel) is just not made to put several magazines downrange in rapid fire.
Because after all, the problems all the fuzz is about only showed up after substained fire of at least about a hundred rounds went through the rifle, heating it up significantly.

What do you guys think?


Max

 

[kwo51]

Service and parts is a problem with HK. Agencies here that used them stopped because of these problems.

 

[Sgt. Rock]

I'd say go to a thicker barrel, which has proven in the past that penciled size barrels DO NOT hold up well in sustained firefights..or go back to the proven NATO 7.62 HK G3 model but in an updated form. Or redo my favorite German assault rifle the Sturmgewehr-44 but make it lighter..a classic design in my opinion.

 

[Bluez]

There is nothing wrong witht he G36.
It has acold hammer forgeed 41V45 barrel made in the best barrel forger in the planet.

But even it is not immune to troops misying it as a squad automatic weapon.
Any barrel will overheat and lose accuracy under hose conditions.

if the German Verteidigungsministerium wanted sustained fire capability they should have spec'ed the rifle as a heavy barrel configuration.
They didn't.

Nothing wrong with the rifle.
Solution to this "problem" : Better training for the troops, make the next batch as HBAR.

 

[kwo51]

To much heat will make most things limp.

 

[Jo6pak]

Palmerwmd pretty much summed it up.
Although the G36 appears to be a "space age gun" the internals are actually quite conventional.
But as with most designs, the rifle will have some teething problems to be worked out after implementation reveals areas of improvement.

 

[Max]

@Palmerwind:
Wouldn't be the first time the german military misused equipment.
Some decades ago we started using an american jet, called it the "Starfighter" (don't remember which Model it was).
The german air force started screwing around with it, to use it for more "roles".
It ended with several of the "butchered" jets crashing, killing a lot of the pilots.

Max

 

[Bluez]

It was the F104G
Designed as an interceptor but used as a strike aircraft in addtion to interceptor roles.

As for misusing an assault rifle as a squad automatic weapon, its not unique to the Bundeswehr.
US troops do it too hence the HBAR modification to the M4A1

 

[Max]

The poor thing, so to say, is, that there is an SAW-version of the G36, with heavy barrel, longer barrel and feeding from a drum magazine, at least.
But the Bundeswehr decided to only buy the G36 and the G36K, not the SAW-version.
Saving money gone wrong...again.

Max

 

[kwo51]

M 60 crews had extra barrels and a hot glove to make rapid changes. Have seen glowing barrels. Slowing down the round count always helps.

 

[Jo6pak]

M60 gunners only needed a glove because the idiots designing the M60 didn't know enough to put a damn handle on the quick change barrel. And then they attached the bipod to the barrel so the poor gunner had to hold the whole thing out of the mud while the AG swapped barrels.

As for the squad automatic version of the G36; There aren't really any SAW versions of any assault rifles that work very well at all. The needs between a sustained fire platform and a rifleman's rifle just don't mesh very well. Designers keep trying it, but it just doesn't work very well.
Anything designed to do a many things doesn't really do anything very well, this applies to tools, firearms, planes, and just about everything else.

The Bundeswehr has a fine light machine gun in the MG4.

 

[Max]

I think I started to understand why a friend of mine, who served in the Bundeswehr, said the german soliders constantly "borrowed" rifles and machine guns from the US-Units.

Max

 

[Bluez]

I think I started to understand why a friend of mine, who served in the Bundeswehr, said the german soliders constantly "borrowed" rifles and machine guns from the US-Units.

Max

No no!

There is NOTHING wrong with the G36.
Its the usual triumph of igniarnce.

The G36 has been in general issue for 20 years!
if anything was "wrong" with it they would jhave known much earlier.

It is not the rifle thats embarrasing itself but Frau Verteidigunsministerin

 

[kwo51]

OK is that far from tutin.

 

[SilvrSRT10]

No no!

It is not the rifle thats embarrasing itself but Frau Verteidigunsministerin

I'll need to confer with Jeff but I'm pretty sure we don't allow that kind of language on this forum.:boxed:

 

[Max]

Most recent news:
The Bundeswehr actually says it was a "fatal mistake" to take a polymer gun into service, as the material is unfit for military-grade stress.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't other polymer guns in military service (like the FNP90 and FN2000, for example) without problems?

Max

 

[Bluez]

Yes they are.
And also the G36 has been in service for 20 years!
If it wasnt a problem before its not a problem now...